Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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nolanvt
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Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by nolanvt »

Good. Kid was guilty of nothing but having the intellectual capacity of Forrest Gump with an overbearing DA out to make a name for himself.

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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by absolutvt03 »

Yeah I was never sure about Avery as far as whether he did it or not. I don't think he should have been convicted based on the evidence but that doesn't mean he was innocent. But Dassey's interrogations and "confessions" were cringe-worthy. I could tell after a few sentences that he had an extremely limited intellect and had no idea what he was even confessing to as evidenced by the fact that he thought he could go back to school afterwards.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by USN_Hokie »

Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
I think he can be tried again without the confession. I'm not sure what other evidence there was. I don't remember any DNA being found but it's been awhile since I watched or looked at the case.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by USN_Hokie »

absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
I think he can be tried again without the confession. I'm not sure what other evidence there was. I don't remember any DNA being found but it's been awhile since I watched or looked at the case.
If what is reported here is true, he's a witness/helped dispose of the body at an absolute minimum.

http://www.pajiba.com/netflix_movies_an ... dassey.php
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by USN_Hokie »

Here's the interview that was on the show:
Here's another:
Notice the date stamps? The first link reports that the interview which aired on the show was to demonstrate he was a reliable, cooperative witness as part of a plea at a later date. He was so laid back and cooperative because he had said it all before.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/m ... sey-856343
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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Yawn, BS TV case brought on by ignorant viewers.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by absolutvt03 »

USN_Hokie wrote:
absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
I think he can be tried again without the confession. I'm not sure what other evidence there was. I don't remember any DNA being found but it's been awhile since I watched or looked at the case.
If what is reported here is true, he's a witness/helped dispose of the body at an absolute minimum.

http://www.pajiba.com/netflix_movies_an ... dassey.php
Just skimmed over it but it all seems to be based on what HE said (either to police or a relative) which changed multiple times. Obviously he was lying at some point and in that situation how can you believe anything he said. I don't see any kind of hard evidence that linked him to the crime. No DNA, no blood, no prints, no witnesses. Nothing. It's literally just "he confessed and his cousin said he cried a lot". It says " Police were able to corroborate much of Dassey’s confession with physical evidence." but it doesn't say what that evidence was. The way Dassey said it happened, it would have involved a LOT of blood in the cramped, carpeted bedroom... and to my knowledge none was ever found there.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by USN_Hokie »

absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
I think he can be tried again without the confession. I'm not sure what other evidence there was. I don't remember any DNA being found but it's been awhile since I watched or looked at the case.
If what is reported here is true, he's a witness/helped dispose of the body at an absolute minimum.

http://www.pajiba.com/netflix_movies_an ... dassey.php
Just skimmed over it but it all seems to be based on what HE said (either to police or a relative) which changed multiple times. Obviously he was lying at some point and in that situation how can you believe anything he said. I don't see any kind of hard evidence that linked him to the crime. No DNA, no blood, no prints, no witnesses. Nothing. It's literally just "he confessed and his cousin said he cried a lot". It says " Police were able to corroborate much of Dassey’s confession with physical evidence." but it doesn't say what that evidence was. The way Dassey said it happened, it would have involved a LOT of blood in the cramped, carpeted bedroom... and to my knowledge none was ever found there.
Looks like you have your mind made up already. I'll just point out that he described the crime scene perfectly without solicitation.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by absolutvt03 »

USN_Hokie wrote:
absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
absolutvt03 wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.
I think he can be tried again without the confession. I'm not sure what other evidence there was. I don't remember any DNA being found but it's been awhile since I watched or looked at the case.
If what is reported here is true, he's a witness/helped dispose of the body at an absolute minimum.

http://www.pajiba.com/netflix_movies_an ... dassey.php
Just skimmed over it but it all seems to be based on what HE said (either to police or a relative) which changed multiple times. Obviously he was lying at some point and in that situation how can you believe anything he said. I don't see any kind of hard evidence that linked him to the crime. No DNA, no blood, no prints, no witnesses. Nothing. It's literally just "he confessed and his cousin said he cried a lot". It says " Police were able to corroborate much of Dassey’s confession with physical evidence." but it doesn't say what that evidence was. The way Dassey said it happened, it would have involved a LOT of blood in the cramped, carpeted bedroom... and to my knowledge none was ever found there.
Looks like you have your mind made up already. I'll just point out that he described the crime scene perfectly without solicitation.
I'm open to any new evidence other than his own statements which have been inconsistent to say the least. The link you posted provided nothing new in terms of evidence which is what I was asking about. I'm not going by just what they showed on the Netflix show BTW. I've done quite a bit of research outside but it was months ago so I don't remember it all. I just don't know how you tie someone to a crime when the only evidence is his statement (which is now inadmissible). You said "the evidence points to him being involved" and so I was curious as to what evidence you were referring to.

My overall stance on the whole case is that Avery might have killed that woman but the police work was so shoddy and questionable that it made it impossible to know for sure. I don't know that the police framed anyone but I do think they decided from the getgo that Avery was the guy and developed tunnel vision. They also said they were going to let another department take over to avoid any appearance of impropriety and then continued to be involved in the case. There's so many sketchy people and actions involved in the case (on both sides) that it's difficult to know who to trust or believe.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by ElbertoHokie »

USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.

He'll probably be retried but the judge ruled that the police violated his rights laid out in the Amendments 5th and 14th. Essentially, the judge said he wasn't smart enough to understand he was incriminating himself and he should have had an adult or lawyer in the room advising him of such. Therefore inadmissable.

I know this confession was used against Avery in his trial, it will be interesting to see how Avery's lawyers use this. It's reasonable to think a judge may throw out Avery's conviction citing a change in evidence. At the very least, he'll get another appeal based on the change in previous evidence.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

Post by nolanvt »

ElbertoHokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:Reasoning here is pretty odd. Though I'd agree the questioning was sketchy as hell, I'm pretty sure the supreme Court has ruled that police can lie to you.

Does this mean he gets tried again without the confession? I hope so, because I'm pretty sure the evidence still points to this kid being involved. He'll likely do it again.

He'll probably be retried but the judge ruled that the police violated his rights laid out in the Amendments 5th and 14th. Essentially, the judge said he wasn't smart enough to understand he was incriminating himself and he should have had an adult or lawyer in the room advising him of such. Therefore inadmissable.

I know this confession was used against Avery in his trial, it will be interesting to see how Avery's lawyers use this. It's reasonable to think a judge may throw out Avery's conviction citing a change in evidence. At the very least, he'll get another appeal based on the change in previous evidence.
I don't think Avery will get his conviction overturned. He's guilty as hell anyway. Dassey couldn't spell cat if you spotted him the C and the T, so I could easily see how the police goaded him into confessing (investigators are trained very well in this regard).
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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nolanvt wrote:
I don't think Avery will get his conviction overturned. He's guilty as hell anyway. Dassey couldn't spell cat if you spotted him the C and the T, so I could easily see how the police goaded him into confessing (investigators are trained very well in this regard).

When I was in college at Tech, I worked part time as a teller at a financial institution. One day another teller's drawer came up $300 short. The police interviewed all the employees and had us fill out a written questionnaire and such. They asked the ones working if they'd come down to the station for an interview which we all did. To this day I have no idea what happened to the money. I really don't think anyone stole it because there were cameras everywhere and it's not like $300 is a ton of money. I always assumed that some of the bills got stuck together and the teller just didn't notice.

Anyways after going to the station, they asked me (I don't know about other employees) if I'd take a lie detector. Being young and naive, I said sure... I had nothing to hide and I knew that. It never really entered into my mind that they thought I took the money. So I went and took the test (which is nothing like you see in the movies btw). Halfway through it, the guy giving the tests accuses me of intentionally trying to screw with the results. His exact words were "I don't know what trick you looked up online but it's not going to work". After repeating the test 2 or 3 times, I was informed I had "failed" it.

At this point I was put in a room with two detectives who took turns trying to goad me into a confession. They said they had "all kinds of evidence" (which I knew wasn't true because I didn't do anything). They said if I made it easy for them then there wouldn't be any jail time and I'd just pay a fine but if I made them work that they'd make sure the judge came down hard on me. I just kept repeating that I didn't do it and knew nothing about what happened. I told them that I was close to getting my degree and having a real job and that I wasn't going to throw that away for $300. But they were insistent that I did it. Finally, after about 4-5 hours of questioning they let me go with the promise that they "would be in touch". I never heard from them again.

In hindsight, I should have never agreed to the polygraph. And once I started getting grilled by the detectives I should have asked if I was under arrest and if not, left. But none of that crossed my mind because I never once considered that they thought I was a suspect.

My point behind all this is I was an adult in my early 20s with a much higher intellect than Dassey and I was caught off-guard and lied to as the police tried to coerce a confession. I can definitely see a teenager with obviously below average intelligence telling the police what they want to hear because he just wants to get out of there. Now maybe he was involved but I would need to see some sort of concrete evidence outside of his ever-changing testimony.

That's the one thing that sticks out to me about this whole case. If Avery and Dassey did kill that woman, they were both smart enough to get rid of almost every speck of DNA evidence inside the house and the garage but dumb enough to leave visible blood streaks inside the car and keep the victim's key in a bedroom. The key I could see as some sort of trophy or memento but the blood streaks on the car were very noticeable. As I said before, I'm not convinced Avery didn't do it (I have way more doubts about Dassey) but the investigation was conducted so poorly that I don't know that I could have convicted him. I said after watching it that part of me hopes he really did do it because otherwise it means one person has been falsely convicted twice for two different crimes.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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absolutvt03 wrote:
nolanvt wrote:
I don't think Avery will get his conviction overturned. He's guilty as hell anyway. Dassey couldn't spell cat if you spotted him the C and the T, so I could easily see how the police goaded him into confessing (investigators are trained very well in this regard).

When I was in college at Tech, I worked part time as a teller at a financial institution. One day another teller's drawer came up $300 short. The police interviewed all the employees and had us fill out a written questionnaire and such. They asked the ones working if they'd come down to the station for an interview which we all did. To this day I have no idea what happened to the money. I really don't think anyone stole it because there were cameras everywhere and it's not like $300 is a ton of money. I always assumed that some of the bills got stuck together and the teller just didn't notice.

Anyways after going to the station, they asked me (I don't know about other employees) if I'd take a lie detector. Being young and naive, I said sure... I had nothing to hide and I knew that. It never really entered into my mind that they thought I took the money. So I went and took the test (which is nothing like you see in the movies btw). Halfway through it, the guy giving the tests accuses me of intentionally trying to screw with the results. His exact words were "I don't know what trick you looked up online but it's not going to work". After repeating the test 2 or 3 times, I was informed I had "failed" it.

At this point I was put in a room with two detectives who took turns trying to goad me into a confession. They said they had "all kinds of evidence" (which I knew wasn't true because I didn't do anything). They said if I made it easy for them then there wouldn't be any jail time and I'd just pay a fine but if I made them work that they'd make sure the judge came down hard on me. I just kept repeating that I didn't do it and knew nothing about what happened. I told them that I was close to getting my degree and having a real job and that I wasn't going to throw that away for $300. But they were insistent that I did it. Finally, after about 4-5 hours of questioning they let me go with the promise that they "would be in touch". I never heard from them again.

In hindsight, I should have never agreed to the polygraph. And once I started getting grilled by the detectives I should have asked if I was under arrest and if not, left. But none of that crossed my mind because I never once considered that they thought I was a suspect.

My point behind all this is I was an adult in my early 20s with a much higher intellect than Dassey and I was caught off-guard and lied to as the police tried to coerce a confession. I can definitely see a teenager with obviously below average intelligence telling the police what they want to hear because he just wants to get out of there. Now maybe he was involved but I would need to see some sort of concrete evidence outside of his ever-changing testimony.

That's the one thing that sticks out to me about this whole case. If Avery and Dassey did kill that woman, they were both smart enough to get rid of almost every speck of DNA evidence inside the house and the garage but dumb enough to leave visible blood streaks inside the car and keep the victim's key in a bedroom. The key I could see as some sort of trophy or memento but the blood streaks on the car were very noticeable. As I said before, I'm not convinced Avery didn't do it (I have way more doubts about Dassey) but the investigation was conducted so poorly that I don't know that I could have convicted him. I said after watching it that part of me hopes he really did do it because otherwise it means one person has been falsely convicted twice for two different crimes.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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awesome guy wrote: You two are equally intelligent.
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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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Good post, absolut. This Dassey kid thought he was going to get to go back to 6th period after finally telling the investigators what they wanted to hear.


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Re: Brendan Dassey's conviction overturned

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nolanvt wrote:Good post, absolut. This Dassey kid thought he was going to get to go back to 6th period after finally telling the investigators what they wanted to hear.


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